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Old 08-18-2013
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Default Issues with 4.0L engine re-build

Hey all.
I have a 2001 Wrangler with a 4.0L engine that was just rebuilt about 1 month ago. Aside from any problems with my inexperience with Jeeps, and small issues that were resolved, (misplaced wire connectors, loose bolts, etc) all problems were resolved, but 2 remain. My inexperience shined through when I disassembled the engine and with out thinking, removed the CPS while not having the engine at TDC, dang! So when the time came to put it all back together I had no idea of the correct position of the CPS. I tried numerous ways to get the engine started but ended up taking it to the local Jeep dealer and after some money exchanging hands they got it started, and enlightened me as to how to pin the CPS into the right position and then install it with the engine at TDC (lesson learned). I didnt really run "great" and was told to bring it back to get it tuned, ( which I didnt right away becasue I thought I could deal with that myself, (mistake 2), but since I still had new issues now that it was running I drove it back to the re-builder to have him deal with a manifold leak.
So it was now drivable, but was getting hot, (210) I was offered a OBDII to play with and try to set the fuel timing myself but to my dismay I really didnt understand the device and timing it went nowhere. So now jump ahead 2 weeks and I take it over to the Jeep dealer near my job 40 miles from home and bite the bullet again and they put it on their computer and then tell me when they set the fuel timing it runs like crap, and they got a whole mixed bag of errors ( didnt get the list) and informed me that if they dive into it it could be like opening Pandora's Box. So as it stands it runs but idle is rough, it seems to top out on power and at lower RPM's than it used to, still overheats (210 - 213 ish) Gas mileage is normal 17-18 MPG, has decent acceleration but not like I was expecting. I am thinking that if the ignition timing is running advanced, that could be contributing to the overheating? I have replaced all but the radiator in the cooling system, but have something going on with no heat in the interior of the cab. (air bubble?)
So here is my question, has anyone experienced these same issues and resolved them, and is there a simple way to set the timing with out handing over my pay check to the Jeep Dealer. Any suggestions will be appreciated.
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Old 08-18-2013
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Originally Posted by volunteer0925 View Post
Hey all.
I have a 2001 Wrangler with a 4.0L engine that was just rebuilt about 1 month ago. Aside from any problems with my inexperience with Jeeps, and small issues that were resolved, (misplaced wire connectors, loose bolts, etc) all problems were resolved, but 2 remain. My inexperience shined through when I disassembled the engine and with out thinking, removed the CPS while not having the engine at TDC, dang! So when the time came to put it all back together I had no idea of the correct position of the CPS. I tried numerous ways to get the engine started but ended up taking it to the local Jeep dealer and after some money exchanging hands they got it started, and enlightened me as to how to pin the CPS into the right position and then install it with the engine at TDC (lesson learned). I didnt really run "great" and was told to bring it back to get it tuned, ( which I didnt right away becasue I thought I could deal with that myself, (mistake 2), but since I still had new issues now that it was running I drove it back to the re-builder to have him deal with a manifold leak.
So it was now drivable, but was getting hot, (210) I was offered a OBDII to play with and try to set the fuel timing myself but to my dismay I really didnt understand the device and timing it went nowhere. So now jump ahead 2 weeks and I take it over to the Jeep dealer near my job 40 miles from home and bite the bullet again and they put it on their computer and then tell me when they set the fuel timing it runs like crap, and they got a whole mixed bag of errors ( didnt get the list) and informed me that if they dive into it it could be like opening Pandora's Box. So as it stands it runs but idle is rough, it seems to top out on power and at lower RPM's than it used to, still overheats (210 - 213 ish) Gas mileage is normal 17-18 MPG, has decent acceleration but not like I was expecting. I am thinking that if the ignition timing is running advanced, that could be contributing to the overheating? I have replaced all but the radiator in the cooling system, but have something going on with no heat in the interior of the cab. (air bubble?)
So here is my question, has anyone experienced these same issues and resolved them, and is there a simple way to set the timing with out handing over my pay check to the Jeep Dealer. Any suggestions will be appreciated.
Check you catalytic converter, running hotter, loss of power at higher RPMs. Now most of my knowledge is on a 97+ Jeep Cherokee, friend and I rebuilt an engine for my 98 XJ last year. I had the problem with the cat with the same symptons you had. Now for the codes that are coming up I doubt that is the catalytic converter. You'll need to get an OBDII scanner. I use a $25 OBDII Bluetooth little nub that I got off or ebay and the Torque app on my smartphone. I hear they have it for iPhone also. If you don't have a smartphone you might need to buy a hand held unit.

It could be that you just need to change out some sensors.

Now as far as CPS removal, why does the engine have to be at TDC? The CPS is a magnet and where the little bit of metal on the flywheel, or flexplate, it senses it and sends a pulse to the ECM telling it the crank position. You can remove the CPS all day long anywhere and when it's back on the computer will use it to figure out where the firing is.

Now if you pulled the "stalk" that goes where the distributor used to be and you're not at TDC that might be a problem. I mean you'd have to get to TDC before you stabbed it back in.

If you're gas mileage is the same it sounds to me that the timing is right, so I'd suspect one, or more of the sensors. If you do have a cat issue you could have one or more bad O2 sensors.

You can also take your Jeep to an auto parts place and they should let you use a scanner. Just write down all the codes. I think long term you'll like to have your own, and they are really cheap now.

Personally, if it was me, and the catalytic converter is 4 or more years old, I'd just replace it. I got one from Amazon for like $120 and a brand new muffler. That way I was certain that it was a clear shot through the exhaust.

Welcome to the site!
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Old 08-20-2013
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Hey thanks Mudderoy for all the info, if I had paid for this site Id a made my money back already!
Ive been thinking about replacing the exhaust with a cat-back system maybe now is the time, mine has 2 converters though, but none the less... I have also been considering the bluetooth ODBII since I listened to the XJ TALK SHOW but just didnt know how much info they will give me, they do sound handy though.
The CPS stalk was pulled from the block and that is where the potential issuemight be coming from? About the sensors though wouldnt I have my engine light showing, it did before when my O2 sensors were out but right now the engine light does not come on at all, which baffles me considering the # of error codes , I think getting the specific code readouts first is in order before I proceed.
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The engine light does work, it comes on at first ignition.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volunteer0925 View Post
Hey thanks Mudderoy for all the info, if I had paid for this site Id a made my money back already!
Ive been thinking about replacing the exhaust with a cat-back system maybe now is the time, mine has 2 converters though, but none the less... I have also been considering the bluetooth ODBII since I listened to the XJ TALK SHOW but just didnt know how much info they will give me, they do sound handy though.
The CPS stalk was pulled from the block and that is where the potential issuemight be coming from? About the sensors though wouldnt I have my engine light showing, it did before when my O2 sensors were out but right now the engine light does not come on at all, which baffles me considering the # of error codes , I think getting the specific code readouts first is in order before I proceed.
Ohhh okay that makes sense. Yeah that stalk "thingy" that's the CAM position sensor or at least it is on mine with the distributor. The CPS is mounted on the back of the block upper drivers side of the bell housing. I think the sensor in the distributor is called the CKS. Yep, not a huge deal just have to put the motor back to TDC and stab the distributor. You have to get it just right though, because a tooth off one way or the other it will run, but it can cause problems.

Hmmm I wonder what the procedure is for putting that stalk thingy back in. With a distributor you use the rotor and where it's pointing in the cap. You ain't got that!
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Old 08-20-2013
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Hmmm...I was hoping you might know that procedure

I thought I read some where that you line up holes in the Cam Pos stalk with a toothpick, pull it out, then put it in the block with the connector facing as far rear as you can while at TDC, but I cant for the life of me find that article again?
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Old 08-20-2013
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Quote:
Originally Posted by volunteer0925 View Post
Hmmm...I was hoping you might know that procedure

I thought I read some where that you line up holes in the Cam Pos stalk with a toothpick, pull it out, then put it in the block with the connector facing as far rear as you can while at TDC, but I cant for the life of me find that article again?
That is the way with the distributor, I've just never looked it up for the non-distributor models.

Hey I found the name of the damn thing. Camshaft Synchronizer

http://www.jeepforum.com/forum/f11/h...ensor-1145301/

Check this out just for grins...

How to replace a camshaft position sensor in your vehicle. - YouTube
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Old 08-21-2013
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Thanks for the additional info! Some how I think Scotty Kilmer (in the video), has a big tire bill.....
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